David Meinart on Chihuly/KEXP

At the blog Publicola, David Meinart has written "A Two-State Solution to the Seattle Center Debate" in which he makes the point that the two can exist side by side in the former Fun Forest: one is paying rental fees, drawing in tourists, and providing a $2 million playground; the other satisfies Seattleites who want something more public and less "upper-middle class tchotchkes" as one commenter writes.  (KEXP is a local radio station supported by public donations.)

Dave Meinart October 2010:

"What C21 didn’t consider, but is also true is that the Chihuly exhibit will bring the most income to the City (about $1 million per year between rent, direct admissions and B&O taxes and even more if secondary business activity is taken into consideration), drive the most people to the Center, and most benefit the neighboring small businesses.
But the most interesting part of the C21 report that seems to have been missed by most of the reporting on the proposals, is that even with its criticism of KEXP’s bid, the C21 committee still recommended Seattle Center find an alternative location for KEXP on campus."

Meinart, D. "A Two-State Solution to the Seattle Center Debate."  Publicola.  October 12, 2010.  http://www.publicola.net/2010/10/12/a-visionary-solution-to-the-seattle-center-debate/

Chihuly in MOHAI?

Heard on NPR today:                                                          

Knute Berger getting the last word in a conversation on the Seattle Center/Fun Forest proposals that are occuring now (this is totally paraphrased):

Moderator:  "There's a new wrinkle in the process, Mayor Mike McGinn is going to be briefed on the decision before the press and public will find out what the City Council's concludes.  I know he favors the KEXP/Chihuly combination proposal.  Maybe he wants to throw MOHAI in there as well." 

Knute Berger: "They can stuff Chihuly and put him in MOHAI."

KUOW 94.9, Seattle.  September 18, 2010.

The Seattle Times supports Chihuly for the Seattle Center

gm_18025 Seattle Center Rides, Washington 1991
Originally uploaded by CanadaGood
Creative Commons license, FLICKR

June 2010, The Seattle Times:

[excerpted] "...Money should not be the only consideration, but it remains a key factor.  Of all the proposals, the one most likely to contribute additional revenue to the center's budget and allow the center to be more helpful to struggling nonprofits is the Chihuly proposal.

The Wright family, which built and owns the Space Needle, made some earlier mistakes on its proposal, mostly by working behind the scenes too quietly.  This is a public space, after all, and that requires public process.

But in the end, the Chihuly plan appears most promising."

Editorials.  "Chihuly's the ticket for Fun Forest site." June 18, 2010.  A24, News.

Account of city council meeting on Seattle Center

photo credit: ABJ Seattle Glass Online 

 

April 1, 2010 Chris Grygiel:

"A proposal to place a Dale Chihuly glass museum at financially-struggling Seattle Center has reopened an old debate about what, exactly, the center should be - a park with open spaces or a hub for the arts.  The fact that it's a little of both right now was evident at a City Council public hearing held Thursday night at Seattle Center. During discussion about the glass museum one speaker referenced New York's Central Park and Lincoln Center, the former one of the world's premier public green spaces and the latter home to the Metropolitan Opera, the New York City Ballet and the New York Philharmonic Orchestra.

About 100 people attended the hearing, the second on the subject this week. A healthy percentage were there to support of a the proposed $15 million glass museum, which the Wright family, owners of the Space Needle, would like to replace the Center's Fun Forest. Supporters Thursday night said it would boost tourism and add to the arts opportunities, not just for visitors but for city residents, too.
Former City Councilmember Tina Podlodowski spoke for Chihuly.

"Dale supports green and open space. The vision of this project is to create an aesthetically pleasing, indoor-outdoor exhibit that adds color and vibrancy amongst green garden space while providing a point of entry to the visual arts that appeal to all ages," she said. "Seattle Center really isn't our Central Park, it's much more like Lincoln Center, a real gathering of a diverse set of arts organizations."  Speakers at Thursday's City Council hearing. But another speaker, Belltown resident Ron Turner, complained that the glass museum proposal seems to contradict earlier, stated goals of increasing green space in Seattle Center.

"The plan was very specific for the Fun Forest site. It said that an asphalt jungle becomes an urban park with trees," Turner said. "It is an active open space that connects to the heart of the campus."
Turner said Belltown residents especially are hungry for green spaces, "where we have little open space...we have practically none. And this is a compliment, because we do use the Center, we do come to the Center, in some respects it is our green yard."

There were complaints that a public hearing earlier this week was stacked with glass museum supporters who arrived early, crowding out opponents. City Councilwoman Sally Bagshaw, who chairs the Parks and Seattle Center Committee, assured people at Thursday's hearing that they "would go til midnight" if necessary.

While it seemed the majority of people at Thursday's meeting were also in favor of the glass museum, council members have reported that they're hearing from more opponents than supporters.
Debates about how to use Seattle Center are nothing new.

During the ill-fated Seattle Monorail Project - the aborted plan to extend monorail service from West Seattle to Ballard - there were plans for tracks to cross the grounds of Seattle Center. Critics howled, saying the trains would disrupt the park-like setting of the Center.

The Fun Forest figured into the rebuttal of those arguments. The Center, monorail proponents said, was home to carnival rides, noisy games and was already the northern terminus of the existing, 1962 World's Fair-era monorail line. It was not an idyllic park, they said. Financial questions led to the dissolution of the Seattle Monorail Project in 2005.

In 2010, the debate about Seattle Center - home to much open green space, as well as places like the Experience Music Project, theaters and Seattle Opera - continues.
As Mayor Mike McGinn has pointed out, the current discussion takes place in a time when the Center is struggling to pay for its existing operations and looking for new sources of revenue. McGinn hasn't taken a position on the Chihuly musuem, other than to say it's proper for the Center to explore the option."

Grygiel, C. "Chihuly debate revives question: Is Center a park or arts hub?"  Seattle Post-Intelligencer blog. http://blog.seattlepi.com/seattlepolitics/archives/200391.asp

David Meinert on Seattle Center/Chihuly plans

April 2010 David Meinert (excerpted from Publicola):

"Seattle Center has never been, and was never designed to be, an oasis of green parkland.  But, fortunately for the rest of us, Seattle Center is almost doubling its current campus open space by developing 3.5 acres of the former Fun Forest space adjacent to the EMP, and soon, 10 acres where Memorial Stadium now stands. That would bring the total of campus open space to over 30 acres from the now 17 acres. [...]  The Wrights will invest part of their fortune to build a temporary exhibit of Seattle’s most popular visual artist ever, Dale Chihuly, who has millions of fans internationally, but no local long-term exhibition.  [...]

As a resident of Queen Anne, a fan of local art and music, a regular user of the Center, an owner of a nearby business that might get some of that tourist business, and an oft-times community activist myself, I must say that I’m pretty happy the City has decided to take advantage of an obviously great deal.

Oh, but wait, this is Seattle.

Nothing is quite that simple. Chihuly is not that “cool” or “relevant” to some of Seattle’s most pernicious bloggers and forum commenters. Oh, and some “rich” folks might actually make a little more money. And in Seattle, that is horrible, because, well, profit is evil I guess, especially when it’s someone else’s who we don’t know. [...]

I want to say this to the critics of this plan – grow the hell up. Embracing diversity means embracing people with different ideas and tastes from our own. And in this case, even though I’m not a huge fan of glass art, and I don’t expect I’ll be going to this exhibit more than a few times when it opens or when I have guests in town, I do believe it can add a lot to the City in the form of tourism, diversity, beauty, and income.  [...]  Let’s be smart this time and not get bogged down in our loathing of local success at the cost of making this a great city."

Meinart, D. "Thumbs up on Chihuly at Seattle Center." Publicola.com. April 11, 2010.  http://www.publicola.net/2010/04/11/thumbs-up-on-chihuly-at-seattle-center/

Op/Ed Letter: glass is 'old hat', rides are thrilling.

Today the Seattle Times published four letters to the editor regarding Chihuly's Seattle Center proposal, all against it. Here's an excerpt from one:

"Seattle doesn’t need a Chihuly building at Seattle Center. There are already so many glass museums throughout the country that it has gotten to be an “old hat” — and the one we have in Tacoma has next to no appeal at all. Really, does any glass museum attract a broad group of visitors?

[...]

Kids need a place to experience the thrill of a ride. So, at least for now, why not put new rides back in place and spend a little money subsidizing them to keep it affordable. It’ll also help much-needed vendor sales in the food court. Promote the idea through media and schools and sell books of tickets at area stores like they do for the Puyallup Fair.

At least give it a try for a year until the economy picks up. The space is ready to go and who knows, maybe even the permits [for the rides] are still current?

— Cathy Schmidt, Issaquah"

More on OLD HATS here...,

Letters editor. "Chihuly's glass house shattering." March 21, 2010. Seattle Times. http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/northwestvoices/2011391406_chihulysglasshouseshattering.html

Glass and Tourism...environmental effects explored

March 2010 ABJ Seattle Glass Online:

In today's Seattle Times article "Grand plan to remake Seattle Center fizzles: makeover lacks money, political will; is Chihuly project next best option?", authors Emily Heffter and Susan Kelleher compare statistics on the major tourist attractions in the area. The Museum of Glass in Tacoma had 177,333 visitors in the 2008-9 fiscal year. The Space Needle, 1.5 million in 2009. The Pacific Science Center, 890,000 and the EMP/SF Museum 511,540 in 2009. Because Mayor Mike McGinn doesn't want to put a levy on the Center up to public vote, the plans cannot be seen through and a private option is the only way to go. Chihuly is said to be the only private option on the table right now. Estimates are that the Chihuly Center could draw 400,000 visitors.

Crosscut writer, Knute Berger, uses Glass Quarterly's recent info on the carbon-footprint of glassblowing to provide another reason to question the Chihuly Center proposed for the park at the base of the Space Needle. He cites an estimate of 90 hot shops "in Seattle." According to him, that would be about the equivalent carbon-emissions of 9,000 households. But this information is useless without something else to compare it to. Is that more "households" than other industries? That's like saying, "This toothpaste works 90% better." Better than what? Compared to what? I don't know the answer, maybe glassblowing is the most polluting industry in Seattle, I'm asking.

But Berger states that Seattle glassblowers are making "beautiful baubles for well-heeled collectors." Which makes all glass blowing in town a pointless endeavor anyhow and any carbon-footprint that comes of it seem like a travesty.

And that is why not just any comparison will do, what we choose to compare the carbon-footprint of glass to must be seen as a luxury good to this author. What could that be? What other "luxury goods" are manufactured in Seattle?

Everyone in the industry already knows that glass has to get more energy-efficient, if not for the environment, then simply to stay in business. But the Crosscut article questions Chihuly at the Seattle Center based on an environmental charge, and in doing so, questions all of the Seattle industry. And that is not a bad charge to make: It should be made on every industry. It is also a relevant charge, because if we're questioning the carbon footprint of the artwork, why not move on to the carbon footprint of all the tourists who will come to see the artwork? All the 1.5 million tourists who travel to see the Space Needle. All the jet fuel, the hotel laundry, the restaurant food... and tell me again, how much of Seattle's economy is based on tourism?

March 2010, Knute Berger:

"Seattle city council president Richard Conlin is reportedly enthused about the new Chihuly complex at Seattle Center, calling it an "extraordinary opportunity," but he's also the one leading the charge against carbon emissions, the ones created to make Chihuly's glass works in the first place. The proposed glass house would be a monument to what can be produced if you burn enough fossil fuel in pursuit of a kind of commercial, artistic alchemy, but symbolically at least, doesn't it rather undercut the city's green messaging?"

Berger, K. "Dale Chihuly's big footprint." Crosscut.com. March 15, 2010. http://crosscut.com/2010/03/15/mossback/19672/

last chance for laser tag...

Here's an update from the Seattle PI blog on the Fun Forest>>Chihuly exhibit. Followed by some comments off the blog....

March 2010 Vanessa Ho:

" [...] Talks are ongoing between Chihuly's people, the Seattle Center and the Space Needle to convert the south end of the Fun Forest into a permanent exhibition space for the Northwest's iconic glass artist, complete with a store and cafe. [...] In 2007, the city decided to shut down the Fun Forest, after watching a steady decline in revenue and crowds no longer attracted to the park's skee balls, bumper cars and "Puff 'n' Dumbo" ride. Created in the wake of the World's Fair, the park had deteriorated so much that then-Seattle City Council president Nick Licata deemed it "a dreary forest." [...] Whatever happens, just don't call the project a "museum." That much was clear from earlier discussions. A museum has rotating exhibits and the exhibit would be a permanent installation of Chihuly's works."

Ho, V. "Chihuly exhibit may replace Fun Forest." Seattle PI blog. March 4, 2010

"Posted by Tenochtitlan at 3/4/2010 8:31 p.m.

It occurs to me that the only time I hear anything about glass art, it's Dale Chihuly's glass art. I've got nothing against the man himself, but surely there are other people in the Pacific Northwest who work with glass, yes? Are they all so utterly inferior as artists that they never warrant attention? Or have they been covered in these pages, and I failed to read about them?"

"Posted by lala555 at 3/4/2010 9:08 p.m.

Enough of the Chihuly! Let's feature some other artists for a change."

"Posted by ken7489 at 3/5/2010 12:10 a.m.

What a waste of prime real estate. Can we stop spending time and money creating things that only have value when you go just once? Take EMP for example - you go once and it's great...but that's about it....maybe again when you have out of town visitors. Can we have things that are worth going to multiple times? Sure there are other artists if you want a platter to put over your mantle. But if it must be glass art on the scale in that conceptual design, then it's gonna be Chihuly. There is nobody else when it comes to this scale."

"Posted by bdouglas0 at 3/5/2010 5:09 a.m.

Great idea. Replace carnival rides with carnival glass."

"Posted by Clark W. Griswold at 3/5/2010 9:44 a.m.

I think most of us agree the Center doesn't need Chihuly's "first-class" artwork. His schtick is getting old. Bring in some younger artistic talent with a fresher sensibility."

"Posted by MAXIMA at 3/5/2010 9:51 a.m.

"For us, it fits our mission, and it would be something unique in the world, and very appropriate given what Dale Chihuly has done for the region," said Seattle Center spokeswoman Deborah Daoust.

And just what is that mission? Decorating?

No thanks, I'd rather have a fun forest."

"Posted by Kurosawa at 3/5/2010 11:23 a.m.

And what's wrong with simply converting it to open space? Folk Life, Bumbershoot, and the Byte could certainly utilize the additional space. We could even include a "free speech" corner for soap box speeches and harangues and/or an open mic for performers (with a "boo meter" to shut off the mic?).

I mean, let's use some imagination. We're Seattle, not a Tacoma copycat."

"Posted by NYFLWA at 3/5/2010 11:31 a.m.

RE: Kurosawa. I'm not sure if the Pier 48 can support that weight.

RE: Chilhuly haters
Yes, we have many talented glass artists in the PNW and their works are are featured in several of our institutions: SAM, MOG, TAM, BAM, etc...

However we're talking about Seattle Center. Chihuly has cache beyond Pugetopolis so when people come to Seattle Center they want to see Chihuly. When you go to Rome you want to see Da Vinci & Michelangelo.

Granted, I hope there'll be room to showcase some of talent but Chihuly is the draw. I love this idea. Looking fwd to the Center House concepts.

The Center's golden anniversary is upon us, time to implement some Century 21 evolution.

And for the record, the EMP is a relevant viable institution. In addition to its permanent exhibits, touring exhibits have thrilled visitors not to mention Sky Church serving as a unique performance hall for Bumbershoot and other festivals. And this weekend EMP hosts the Sound Off! Finals f. the best of our underaged talent. Gigs at Bumbershoot and NW Folklife are up for grabs.

It's taken far too long but much needed attention is being paid to our community's backyard, Seattle Center."

"Posted by Mag00 at 3/5/2010 2:54 p.m.

While I like Chihuly I would much rather have Fostoria Heirloom, go look it up on Ebay. This glass has been around since the 50's and everytime someone comes to my house they ask if it is Chihuly's. So many of his pieces seem to be a badly done example of the Fostoria Heirloom line."

Chihuly to replace Fun Forest?

It's possible that Seattle may get a permanent Chihuly exhibit where the Fun Forest is right now under the Space Needle. What? The Fun Forest is closing? First they demolished Never Never Land at Point Defiance Park, then the Nocturnal Exhibit at the Woodland Park Zoo and now the Fun Forest. They are deliberatly plucking all the childhood memories out. What's next...Wild Waves?

Why replace? I'm all for a wicked combination of the two: Old rickety roller coasters, decrepid merry go round animals, and a jungle of Chihuly glass creeping up through the ruins.

(This article also gives an interesting little taste of a Northwest city rivalry.)

From Meg Coyle @ King5 today:

"SEATTLE - The future of Seattle Center's Fun Forest is a little clearer and maybe a lot more colorful. It closes for good later this year, and could reopen with something brand new and uniquely Northwest. [...] "People can see how artists work in glass and that is real seductive in itself," says museum director Tim Close. [...] It could soon show up in Seattle in a big way. Chihuly and Wright Art, LLC are in talks to open a Chihuly Center on the site of the old Fun Forest. [...] But Tacoma has become all but synonomous with Chihuly and glass art. Museum of Glass director Tim Close is prepared to share the wealth, even if it is with Seattle. "I think naturally we'd like it in Tacoma, but we're going to be supportive of Dale and we'll see how it goes," he said. And if all goes as planned, we could see Dale Chihuly at Seattle Center sometime next year."

Excerpted from: Coyle, M. "Chihuly glass exhibition may come to Seattle Center." King 5 News. January 6, 2010, accessed same day. http://www.king5.com/news/local/Chihuly-Glass-Exhibition-Coming-to-Seattle-Center-80859032.html